Dr. Jeff Masters' WunderBlog

Was the 2010 Haiti Earthquake triggered by deforestation and the 2008 hurricanes?
Posted by: Dr. Jeff Masters, 2:57 PM GMT on December 20, 2010 +11
Major earthquakes occur when the stress on rocks between two tectonic plates reaches a critical breaking point, allowing the earth to move along the connecting fault. While the slow creep of the tectonic plates makes earthquakes inevitable along major faults, the timing and exact location of the quake epicenter can be influenced by outside forces pushing down on Earth's crust. For example, the sloshing of water into the Eastern Pacific during El Niño events has been linked to magnitude 4, 5, and 6 earthquakes on the seafloor below, due to the extra weight of water caused by local sea level rise. Sea level rise due to rapid melting of Earth's ice sheets could also potentially trigger earthquakes, though it is unknown at what melting rate such an effect might become significant.


Figure 1. Google Earth image of Haiti taken November 8, 2010, showing the capital of Port-Au-Prince and the mountainous region to its west where the epicenter of the 2010 earthquake was. Note the brown color of the mountains, where all the vegetation has been stripped off, leaving bare slopes subject to extreme erosion. Heavy rains in recent years have washed huge amounts of sediment into the Leogane Delta to the north.


Figure 2. Zoom-in view of the Leogane Delta region of Figure 1, showing the large expansion in the Delta's area between 2002 and 2010. High amounts of sediments have been eroded from Haiti's deforested mountains and deposited in the Delta. Recent expansion of the river channel due to runoff from Hurricane Tomas' rains is apparent in the 2010 image. Image credit: Google Earth, Digital Globe, GeoEye.

At last week's American Geophysical Union (AGU) meeting last week in San Francisco, Shimon Wdowinsky of the University of Miami proposed a different method whereby unusual strains on the crust might trigger an earthquake. In a talk titled, Triggering of the 2010 Haiti earthquake by hurricanes and possibly deforestation , Wdowinsky studied the stresses on Earth's crust over the epicenter of the mighty January 12, 2010 Haiti earthquake that killed over 200,000 people. This quake was centered in a mountainous area of southwest Haiti that has undergone severe deforestation—over 98% of the trees have been felled on the mountain in recent decades, allowing extreme erosion to occur during Haiti's frequent heavy rainfall events. Since 1975, the erosion rate in these mountains has been 6 mm/year, compared to the typical erosion rate of less than 1 mm/yr in forested tropical mountains. Satellite imagery (Figure 2) reveals that the eroded material has built up significantly in the Leogane Delta to the north of the earthquake's epicenter. In the 2008 hurricane season, four storms--Fay, Gustav, Hanna, and Ike--dumped heavy rains on the impoverished nation. The bare, rugged hillsides let flood waters rampage into large areas of the country, killing over 1,000, destroying 22,702 homes, and damaging another 84,625. About 800,000 people were affected--8% of Haiti's total population. The flood wiped out 70% of Haiti's crops, resulting in dozens of deaths of children due to malnutrition in the months following the storms. Damage was estimated at over $1 billion, the costliest natural disaster in Haitian history. The damage amounted to over 5% of the country's $17 billion GDP, a staggering blow for a nation so poor. Tragically, the hurricanes of 2008 may have set up Haiti for an ever larger disaster. Wdowinsky computed that the amount of mass eroded away from the mountains over the epicenter of the 2010 earthquake was sufficient to cause crustal strains capable of causing a vertically-oriented slippage along a previously unknown fault. This type of motion is quite unusual in this region, as most quakes in Haiti tend to be of the strike-slip variety, where the tectonic plates slide horizontally past each other. The fact that the 2010 Haiti quake occurred along a vertically moving fault lends support to the idea that the slippage was triggered due to mass stripped off the mountains by erosion over the epicenter, combined with the extra weight of the extra sediment deposited in the Leogane Delta clamping down on the northern portion of the fault. Wdowinsky gave two other examples in Taiwan where earthquakes followed several months after the passage of tropical cyclones that dumped heavy rains over mountainous regions. His theory of tropical cyclone-triggered quakes deserves consideration, and provides another excellent reason to curb excessive deforestation!


Figure 3. Two of 2008's four tropical cyclones that ravaged Haiti: Tropical Storm Hanna (right) and Hurricane Gustav (left). Image taken at 10:40 am EDT September 1, 2008. Image credit: NASA/GSFC.

Christmas in Haiti
Portlight.org will brighten the lives of hundreds of kids in Haiti this week, thanks to their successful Christmas in Haiti fundraiser. Portlight raised $1800 to buy toys, candies, and other assorted goodies. The shipment left Charleston last week, and will arrive in time for Christmas. Thanks to everyone who helped support this worthy effort!

Jeff Masters
Stuff for Haiti (Portlight)
Stuff for Haiti
Ms. Mae (Portlight)
Ms. Mae
Categories: Hurricane Earthquake
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601. Skyepony (Mod) 4:55 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Recovered from the eclipse/solstice party. Here's the best pic I could get during totality..

click pic to make big
Member Since: August 10, 2005 Posts: 145 Comments: 29957
602. HurricaneKatrina 4:55 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
A global superstorm is likely. It will be ironic that global warming will freeze us to death. http://www.globalsuperstorm.bravehost.com/whatis.html
Member Since: August 19, 2008 Posts: 27 Comments: 267
603. Seastep 4:57 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Great pic, Skye. Thanks for sharing.
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604. greentortuloni 4:58 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Anyway, Ciao, my ride is here.
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606. HurricaneKatrina 5:02 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting cat5hurricane:

Absolutely positively no way you can prove what you just stated regarding the cause of the earth going through a warming trend. None. At the most, you can skew the data, tailor the numbers, do whatever it takes to continue to push forward a bogus agenda: AGW

Give it 15 -20 years and you'll all be talking off the next ice age just like the folks in the wake of the 1970's, 80's winters. It's a hot topic right now, sure. But a trendy one, governed by falsifying data to one's likings to make wild and frivolous accusations that man is the cause of a multi-billion year old planet's rapid demise.

Keep following the $$
All the way to exxon and royal dutch hell
Member Since: August 19, 2008 Posts: 27 Comments: 267
607. keywestdingding 5:03 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
why is everyone trying to prove everyone else wrong. is this a weather blog or an ego battling blog? I say everyone is right to some degree and everyone is wrong to some degree. no one knows what's going to happen in 10 years or even one year. i know my little blog has no barring one anyone, just my two cents!!
Happy Holidays and Merry Christmas everyone.
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608. hcubed 5:03 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting greentortuloni:
All the agencies are reporting that sea ice shrank in the last week. The data is from the Fairy Godmother of Denialist himself, Anthony Watts.


And it seems like just yesterday that someone mentioned "poisoning the well".

If you can't refute the evidence, trash the messenger...
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609. caneswatch 5:03 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Didn't want to post until now, but the show was great last night. I would love to see one again.
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610. Neapolitan 5:04 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting FLWaterFront:


I think something needs to be mentioned here.. again.

...in our most recent advancement to a technological civilization, we have developed an odd view of ourselves and one which tends to ascribe to us more power over our surroundings than we actually possess. This is, in effect, an illusion. Just as in earlier eras when we as a species had relatively little technological acumen, we are all ultimately helpless against nature.

Even if we somehow manage to live full life spans without ever encountering either natural or manmade disaster on either a broad or very limited scale, then we succumb to our own mortality at some point. And it is also inevitable that no matter how much technological expertise we shall eventually acquire as a civilization, at some point in time the forces of nature will slam us very hard and pare us back greatly in numbers. It is also possible that if we fail to develop the ability to leave this Earth and colonize other worlds soon enough, natural catastrophe could wipe us all out altogether.

My point here is that there simply is not much to be gained by worrying about that which we cannot control, nor is there much sense to exaggerating our own potential for controlling or altering our own environment, either for better or worse. Even if we are presently doing that it is not likely to be the source of our ultimate demise. Instead, the forces which are endemic to our cosmic realm will be the likely cause for that.

In the meantime, there is just not much sense in fretting too much about any of it.

As has been proven numerous times, it's not in the least an exaggeration of man's potential for us to say we are quite capable of causing widespread and irreparable harm to the planet. Denying we have the ability to do so? Now that's the illusion. Yes, it's true that a cometary impact or CME or some other catastrophe beyond our control could, in effect, hit Earth's reset button before we have the chance to do it ourselves. But it's awfully cynical--not to mention taking a huge and twisted leap of nihilistic logic--to say that since Mother Nature may elect to buck us all off the horse somewhere down the road, we shouldn't even bother doing the things we need to to hold on now. And I can imagine our descendants won't be happy to know that some of their ancestors felt that way.
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611. FLWaterFront 5:08 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting HurricaneKatrina:
A global superstorm is likely. It will be ironic that global warming will freeze us to death. http://www.globalsuperstorm.bravehost.com/whatis.html


What is interesting is that if one is old enough, they can possibly remember a time not long ago at all when the fear program that was running was different.

In that earlier era, we were all programmed to believe that the source of our human-caused destruction was going to be a full-scale nuclear war. But oddly, even though there still remain some 50,000 or more nuclear warheads on this planet, no one much talks about that anymore and even fewer fear it. This is because that old fear program has been deleted and is now replaced with a new one.

Today, the new fear program that has been installed and is running involves the various dreaded scenarios which will supposedly unfold due to climate change.

One can only wonder at what the fear program will be for the next generation. Whatever it is, once it is installed and the present one involving climatic devastation has been deleted, surprisingly few will remember what all of the fears about climate change were all about.
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612. FLWaterFront 5:12 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting keywestdingding:
why is everyone trying to prove everyone else wrong. is this a weather blog or an ego battling blog? I say everyone is right to some degree and everyone is wrong to some degree. no one knows what's going to happen in 10 years or even one year. i know my little blog has no barring one anyone, just my two cents!!
Happy Holidays and Merry Christmas everyone.


Very true what you say and thanks for mentioning it.

But the problem here seems to be that too many on this blog enjoy that battle of the egos that you mentioned. Of course it will go nowhere and no one will have their mind changed but what the hey? I guess it must be invigorating for a lot of the participants.
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613. washingtonian115 5:16 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting caneswatch:
Didn't want to post until now, but the show was great last night. I would love to see one again.
Last night on the blog was awesome.For once people wern't takling about some global warming crap,and could actually have a very good conversation about almost anything weather related(or not in some cases).
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614. Neapolitan 5:16 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting cat5hurricane:

Absolutely positively no way you can prove what you just stated regarding the cause of the earth going through a warming trend. None. At the most, you can skew the data, tailor the numbers, do whatever it takes to continue to push forward a bogus agenda: AGW

Give it 15 -20 years and you'll all be talking off the next ice age just like the folks in the wake of the 1970's, 80's winters. It's a hot topic right now, sure. But a trendy one, governed by falsifying data to one's likings to make wild and frivolous accusations that man is the cause of a multi-billion year old planet's rapid demise.

Keep following the $$

Ah, I see you again failed to respond to the question: what's causing the planet's "natural warming trend" to which you referred? And now a follow-up: what will cause the coming ice age you predict?
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615. FLWaterFront 5:19 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Neapolitan:

As has been proven numerous times, it's not in the least an exaggeration of man's potential for us to say we are quite capable of causing widespread and irreparable harm to the planet. Denying we have the ability to do so? Now that's the illusion. Yes, it's true that a cometary impact or CME or some other catastrophe beyond our control could, in effect, hit Earth's reset button before we have the chance to do it ourselves. But it's awfully cynical--not to mention taking a huge and twisted leap of nihilistic logic--to say that since Mother Nature may elect to buck us all off the horse somewhere down the road, we shouldn't even bother doing the things we need to to hold on now. And I can imagine our descendants won't be happy to know that some of their ancestors felt that way.


You misread my point.

I did not say that humankind is incapable of destroying itself. I also did not say that there is no point in trying to repair or retract the potential causes of this possible destruction.

All I was trying to do was to remind others of the bigger picture. If you notice, buried in the middle of that commentary was a mention of the fact that no matter what is accomplished here or not accomplished by us, we are all going to have our reset buttons pressed at some point. And this will happen regardless whether it be the way it usually is, as individuals, or en masse.
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616. Patrap 5:21 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
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617. JRRP 5:25 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Neapolitan:

Ah, I see you again failed to respond to the question: what's causing the planet's "natural warming trend" to which you referred? And now a follow-up: what will cause the coming ice age you predict?

CO2 ??
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618. calusakat 5:26 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Minnemike:
Calusakat, my current comments are designed to mirror yours. I cannot use truth, nor address the issues when doing so simply because you have not.

Your meager attempts to cite a lack in certain protocols, and calling that addressing the issue is pitiful. There is so much information out there to counter your claims, and there has been much debate between bloggers here who ACTUALLY DO THEIR HOMEWORK.

But for me to mirror your posts, I have to come up with my retorts completely off the cuff. I can't provide any evidence to the contrary because you will just call those talking points out of the AGW handbook, call me sheeple, and then claim that all those figures and counterpoints are falsified anyway.

So there it is... look at my posts and see yourself. I am using you as a model here. I simply cannot provide an iota of evidence primarily because you have not done so. As soon as you start providing evidence, I'll follow suit. If anyone here is looking for the information neither one of us are posting, they can simply ignore the two of us and view the quality dialogue already present on this, and several days worth of blogs.



Twist and turn, tap the AGW dance all you want.

I am not the one who is proposing a new view...you are.

I do not have any homework to do because you and your AGW lemming friends have yet to give us free and unfettered access to the information and methodology that would allow us to decide one way or the other.

It is YOUR responsibility to prove your position is the correct one. The fact that I do not accept your assertions is your problem, not mine. I owe you not one bit of anything.

You have yet to address the problems with the fact that there is no protocol for making sure the information true and correct.

You do not address the fact that all of the information and the computer assumptions, is not freely available for all to see for themselves. Not to mention the scientists themselves who falsify the data or are duped into believing it to be true.

Apparently, the information is not freely available because it is totally and completely fraudulent, why else hide it.




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619. MiamiHurricanes09 5:26 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
I was lucky to have completely clear skies here in Miami as the lunar eclipse took place earlier this morning. The image below was taken at 3:17a.m EDT, which was roughly the exact time that the moon was at the center of the umbra.



A better image available at Wikipedia showcases a much more clearer view of the moon as it passed through the center umbra (image from Orlando, Florida).

Member Since: September 2, 2009 Posts: 129 Comments: 20002
620. calusakat 5:29 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting HurricaneKatrina:
All the way to exxon and royal dutch hell


Change that to billionaire and sheeple investors worldwide and you would be much closer to the truth.


Member Since: October 10, 2008 Posts: 0 Comments: 716
621. Minnemike 5:30 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting keywestdingding:
why is everyone trying to prove everyone else wrong. is this a weather blog or an ego battling blog? I say everyone is right to some degree and everyone is wrong to some degree. no one knows what's going to happen in 10 years or even one year. i know my little blog has no barring one anyone, just my two cents!!
Happy Holidays and Merry Christmas everyone.
i know i play a role in this post, but i'm just trying to get someone to prove they are right. i may have a sizable ego at the wheel to guide me on my quest, but effective dialogue is the end sought via such twisted means. by the hand of a particular blogger, effective dialogue is beyond comprehension at the moment. so forgive the space he and i waste during these ridiculous exchanges.
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622. Patrap 5:31 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
The "iggy" and "Hide" features are getting a double dose workout.
Member Since: July 3, 2005 Posts: 377 Comments: 112955
623. Patrap 5:36 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Member Since: July 3, 2005 Posts: 377 Comments: 112955
624. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod) 5:38 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 147 Comments: 41318
625. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod) 5:38 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Magnitude 7.4 - BONIN ISLANDS, JAPAN REGION
2010 December 21 17:19:41 UTC
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 147 Comments: 41318
626. sailingallover 5:39 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Neapolitan:

Ah, I see you again failed to respond to the question: what's causing the planet's "natural warming trend" to which you referred? And now a follow-up: what will cause the coming ice age you predict?

What caused th efirst ice ages? What caused the dinosaurs to go extinct..
We look at evidence and make educated GUESSES..
WE ARE MAKING THE PLANET WARMER TO SOME DEGREE THROUGH URBAN HEATING..
We are most likely changing the weather patterns a bit in the densely populated areas
but every time I hear about CGW I want to say exactly what the post you responded to says..
Member Since: September 1, 2009 Posts: 23 Comments: 982
627. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod) 5:39 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
000
pat got it
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 147 Comments: 41318
628. Patrap 5:40 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
000
WEPA42 PHEB 211731
TIBPAC

TSUNAMI BULLETIN NUMBER 001
PACIFIC TSUNAMI WARNING CENTER/NOAA/NWS
ISSUED AT 1731Z 21 DEC 2010

THIS BULLETIN APPLIES TO AREAS WITHIN AND BORDERING THE PACIFIC
OCEAN AND ADJACENT SEAS...EXCEPT ALASKA...BRITISH COLUMBIA...
WASHINGTON...OREGON AND CALIFORNIA.

... TSUNAMI INFORMATION BULLETIN ...

THIS BULLETIN IS FOR INFORMATION ONLY.

THIS BULLETIN IS ISSUED AS ADVICE TO GOVERNMENT AGENCIES. ONLY
NATIONAL AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT AGENCIES HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO MAKE
DECISIONS REGARDING THE OFFICIAL STATE OF ALERT IN THEIR AREA AND
ANY ACTIONS TO BE TAKEN IN RESPONSE.

AN EARTHQUAKE HAS OCCURRED WITH THESE PRELIMINARY PARAMETERS
REPORTED BY THE JAPAN METEOROLOGICAL AGENCY.

ORIGIN TIME - 1720Z 21 DEC 2010
COORDINATES - 27.5 NORTH 143.4 EAST
DEPTH - 10 KM
LOCATION - BONIN ISLANDS JAPAN REGION
MAGNITUDE - 7.4

EVALUATION

NO DESTRUCTIVE WIDESPREAD TSUNAMI THREAT EXISTS BASED ON
HISTORICAL EARTHQUAKE AND TSUNAMI DATA.

HOWEVER - EARTHQUAKES OF THIS SIZE SOMETIMES GENERATE LOCAL
TSUNAMIS THAT CAN BE DESTRUCTIVE ALONG COASTS LOCATED WITHIN
A HUNDRED KILOMETERS OF THE EARTHQUAKE EPICENTER. AUTHORITIES
IN THE REGION OF THE EPICENTER SHOULD BE AWARE OF THIS
POSSIBILITY AND TAKE APPROPRIATE ACTION.

THIS WILL BE THE ONLY BULLETIN ISSUED FOR THIS EVENT UNLESS
ADDITIONAL INFORMATION BECOMES AVAILABLE.

THE JAPAN METEOROLOGICAL AGENCY MAY ALSO ISSUE TSUNAMI MESSAGES
FOR THIS EVENT TO COUNTRIES IN THE NORTHWEST PACIFIC AND SOUTH
CHINA SEA REGION. IN CASE OF CONFLICTING INFORMATION... THE
MORE CONSERVATIVE INFORMATION SHOULD BE USED FOR SAFETY.

THE WEST COAST/ALASKA TSUNAMI WARNING CENTER WILL ISSUE PRODUCTS
FOR ALASKA...BRITISH COLUMBIA...WASHINGTON...OREGON...CALIFORNIA.
...SP...
Member Since: July 3, 2005 Posts: 377 Comments: 112955
629. TomTaylor 5:43 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting cat5hurricane:

Absolutely positively no way you can prove what you just stated regarding the cause of the earth going through a warming trend. None. At the most, you can skew the data, tailor the numbers, do whatever it takes to continue to push forward a bogus agenda: AGW

Give it 15 -20 years and you'll all be talking off the next ice age just like the folks in the wake of the 1970's, 80's winters. It's a hot topic right now, sure. But a trendy one, governed by falsifying data to one's likings to make wild and frivolous accusations that man is the cause of a multi-billion year old planet's rapid demise.

Keep following the $$


I love the classic agw argument that pro GW folk are in it for money. Two things are terribly wrong with that claim. One, they never provide evidence. Ever. And two, if anything, the money is in agw. Pro GW folk are pushing towards what would end the oil industry--the richest of all industries.

Thirdly, The debate isn't't if we are warming, its what is causing the warming. Now, do you believe in the greenhouse gas theory? Do you recognize that humans are adding greenhouse gases to the air?

If you said no to either of the above questions, you're wrong. If you said yes to the questions then you would recognize humans play a role in the current warming period. To what extent we will never know.
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630. sailingallover 5:43 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Looks like shear is getting to out potential little TS earlier than predicted...
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632. Patrap 5:44 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
#629


plus 100
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633. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod) 5:45 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
To: U.S. West Coast, Alaska, and British Columbia coastal regions
From: NOAA/NWS/West Coast and Alaska Tsunami Warning Center
Subject: Tsunami Information Statement #1 issued 12/21/2010 at 9:32AM PST

A strong earthquake has occurred, but a tsunami IS NOT expected along the California, Oregon, Washington, British Columbia, or Alaska coast. NO tsunami warning, watch or advisory is in effect for these areas.

Based on the earthquake magnitude, location and historic tsunami records, a damaging tsunami IS NOT expected along the California, Oregon, Washington, British Columbia, and Alaska coasts. At coastal locations which have experienced strong ground shaking, local tsunamis are possible due to underwater landslides.

At 9:20 AM Pacific Standard Time on December 21, an earthquake with preliminary magnitude 7.4 occurred in the Bonin Islands, Japan region . (Refer to the United States Geological Survey for official earthquake parameters.)

Pacific coastal regions outside California, Oregon, Washington, British Columbia, and Alaska should refer to the Pacific Tsunami Warning Center messages for information on the event.

This will be the only statement issued for this event by the West Coast/Alaska Tsunami Warning Center unless conditions warrant. See the WCATWC web site for basic tsunami information, safety rules, and a tsunami travel time map and table. (NOTE: Travel time maps and tables indicate forecasted times only, not that a wave was generated.)

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634. Drakoen 5:46 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Patrap:
#629


100


I saw that. lol
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635. Patrap 5:48 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
..nuthing gets past da Drak..
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636. Minnemike 5:48 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting calusakat:



Twist and turn, tap the AGW dance all you want.

I am not the one who is proposing a new view...you are.

I do not have any homework to do because you and your AGW lemming friends have yet to give us free and unfettered access to the information and methodology that would allow us to decide one way or the other.

It is YOUR responsibility to prove your position is the correct one. The fact that I do not accept your assertions is your problem, not mine. I owe you not one bit of anything.

You have yet to address the problems with the fact that there is no protocol for making sure the information true and correct.

You do not address the fact that all of the information and the computer assumptions, is not freely available for all to see for themselves. Not to mention the scientists themselves who falsify the data or are duped into believing it to be true.

Apparently, the information is not freely available because it is totally and completely fraudulent, why else hide it.




for a brief moment, i shall seriously reply so you have a clue who you are dealing with.

i am not an AGW proponent. I am of mixed beliefs, and have stayed any convictions. I hedge my bets by supporting actions that would combat AGW should it be true, and I am of sound an open mind to digest all factors that may prove true contrary to AGW beliefs. I am on the lookout for scientific information. I don't think you know what that actually means.

That is why on a previous post some days back, I stated that I fall somewhere between Atmoaggie's scientific-based skepticism, and Neapolitan's scientific-based concerns. I find that both of these bloggers epitomize effective discourse over the MASSIVE amounts of data available.

But then there's you, denying a warming climate, accusing all climate scientists of lying to get money, and accusing people here of being mindless sheep. Never have you backed up your claims with supporting evidence. Still you refuse to answer the call to prove that climate scientists are corrupt money grubbers.

You just don't get that I am coming at you without being an AGW proponent. Every attempt to counter my posts in such a light is another misstep by you. So answer the call for proof, once and for all, the corruption you see in the climate research community.

Now i will go back to mirroring your method of finger pointed comments... at least until you support your claim about the money-based motivations of fraudulent climate research. That is the only item I have, and will continue to address with you. If we can put that to rest, maybe, just maybe, we can enter a discussion about the results of the data and accompanying research.
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637. Neapolitan 5:49 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting sailingallover:

What caused th efirst ice ages? What caused the dinosaurs to go extinct..
We look at evidence and make educated GUESSES..
WE ARE MAKING THE PLANET WARMER TO SOME DEGREE THROUGH URBAN HEATING..
We are most likely changing the weather patterns a bit in the densely populated areas
but every time I hear about CGW I want to say exactly what the post you responded to says..

It's universally accepted that the impact of a large bolide 65 million years ago both created the Chixculub crater and triggered the extinction of dinosaurs and much other life.

To state that "urban heating" has changed weather patterns a bit in populated areas may be true, but that's only a small part of the whole story. The increased amounts of CO2 we've been pumping into the atmosphere for decades now is altering the climate globally, most evident in rapid warming.
Member Since: November 8, 2009 Posts: 4 Comments: 11302
638. ka9qlq 5:50 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Does ANYONE here ever wonder why poor countries deforest? The people don't have any other way to cook or heat or make money because the global scam crowd wont push the dictators to allow freedom (freedom always grows economies) like they push free economies to become socialist.
Member Since: December 21, 2010 Posts: 0 Comments: 0
639. Patrap 5:54 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
To all who helped make the portlight Xmas in Haiti effort, a complete success,from Jeff Masters and the wunderground,to Wal Mart..in S.Carolina,


.."I wanna Thank You"..
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640. WeatherNerdPR 5:56 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Hey everybody! Too bad I overslept and couldn't get a picture of the eclipse.
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641. Drakoen 6:00 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Patrap:
..nuthing gets past da Drak..


Just lurking a bit and thought it was funny.
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642. Patrap 6:01 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
..Merry Christmas Drak,...
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643. Patrap 6:02 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Eclipse near Totality,

Uptown NOLA

Captureview Binocular Cam



...earlier,halfway there.


Member Since: July 3, 2005 Posts: 377 Comments: 112955
644. Drakoen 6:04 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Patrap:
..Merry Christmas Drak,...


Merry...Christmas...to...you...too...
Member Since: October 28, 2006 Posts: 57 Comments: 29012
645. washingtonian115 6:09 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting Drakoen:


Merry...Christmas...to...you...too...
Hello.I hope all is well in school?.Seems that you also have time on your hands to day.Did school let out for break?
Member Since: August 14, 2010 Posts: 5 Comments: 11180
647. Jax82 6:12 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Jeez all this global warming talk when we have a very important Invest to follow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL
Member Since: September 2, 2008 Posts: 1 Comments: 1261
648. Drakoen 6:12 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting washingtonian115:
Hello.I hope all is well in school?.Seems that you also have time on your hands to day.Did school let out for break?


Yes it did. Everything is going well in school so far. Can't wait to start getting into the actual Major material in the fall.
Member Since: October 28, 2006 Posts: 57 Comments: 29012
650. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod) 6:13 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
Quoting SpyderedypS:
Ayo son, ayo son list3n at dis naw m3an. I's w3r3's 0utsid3 las nit3 smokin dis g00d a55 kush naw m3an. All da sudd3nt lyk3 da m00n b3 disp33rin ya diggggg? D3n I's s33nt da moon turn lyk3 orng3 n whatnot. Did lyk3 any of yall ni66as s33nt dat?
hello chump i mean chimp guess one ban is not enough num 2 coming up
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 147 Comments: 41318
651. KEEPEROFTHEGATE (Mod) 6:15 PM GMT on December 21, 2010    
yo too MSREDNECK you are history
Member Since: July 15, 2006 Posts: 147 Comments: 41318

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About JeffMasters
Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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